gardening in the novascene

  1. Cyanobacteria—Multicellular Organisms, Humans—Post-Biological Life

  2. The Internet as an Ecosystem for Post-Biological Life

  3. Ecosystem Destruction & Virtuality

  4. 2D vs. 3D Internet, as Ecological Niche

  5. Corporations, Governments and Individuals as Stewards of Post-Biological Life


(1.) Cyanobacteria—Multicellular Organisms, Humans—Post-Biological Life


Do you know how the cyano bacteria converted the earth's atmosphere from carbon dioxide to oxygen, and then died, paving the way for multicellular organisms?

Yes, the transformation of Earth's atmosphere by cyanobacteria is a pivotal event in the history of our planet. This process is known as the Great Oxygenation Event (GOE), and it occurred approximately 2.4 billion years ago.

Cyanobacteria are among the earliest forms of life on Earth, dating back at least 3.5 billion years. These bacteria are unique because they perform oxygenic photosynthesis, a process similar to what plants do today. During photosynthesis, cyanobacteria use sunlight to convert water and carbon dioxide into oxygen and organic compounds.

The GOE unfolded over hundreds of millions of years. Initially, the oxygen produced by cyanobacteria was absorbed by the oceans and reacted with iron, leading to the formation of banded iron formations. Once the iron in the oceans was saturated with oxygen, the excess oxygen started to accumulate in the atmosphere.

This dramatic increase in atmospheric oxygen had profound effects:

  1. Oxidation of Earth's Surface: The introduction of oxygen led to the oxidation of many elements on the Earth's surface, changing the chemical composition of both the atmosphere and the lithosphere.

  2. Extinction of Anaerobic Organisms: Many of the existing anaerobic organisms, which thrived in an oxygen-free environment, couldn't survive in the new, oxygen-rich atmosphere. This led to a mass extinction of these anaerobic organisms.

  3. Evolution of Aerobic Life: The increase in atmospheric oxygen made it possible for more complex, aerobic (oxygen-using) life forms to develop, including multicellular organisms.

  4. Formation of the Ozone Layer: Oxygen in the upper atmosphere gradually formed the ozone layer, which was crucial for protecting life on Earth from harmful ultraviolet (UV) radiation.

Contrary to the idea that cyanobacteria themselves died out as a result of this event, they actually continued to thrive and still exist today. They adapted to various ecological niches and played a significant role in shaping life as we know it.

The GOE is a classic example of how microbial life can have a massive impact on the planet's environment, setting the stage for future evolutionary developments.


Isn't this an example of how the earth evolves towards greater and greater complexity through "stacking" events? Organisms produce a stack that the next more complicated organisms need to survive, flourish, grow.

Yes. The history of life on Earth can indeed be seen as a series of "stacking" events, where each stage sets the groundwork for the next level of complexity. This concept is a crucial aspect of both evolutionary biology and Earth's ecological history. Let's delve into how this "stacking" or cumulative process works:

  1. Chemical and Biological Foundations: Initially, Earth's environment and the simple chemical processes laid the foundation for the emergence of life. The formation of basic organic molecules and the development of primitive cells marked the first significant steps in this stacking process.

  2. Photosynthesis and Oxygenation: As you pointed out with cyanobacteria, the advent of photosynthesis was a pivotal stacking event. By producing oxygen as a byproduct, cyanobacteria transformed Earth's atmosphere and made it habitable for aerobic organisms. This change was not just a single event but a gradual accumulation that had a profound impact on subsequent evolutionary pathways.

  3. Development of Complex Cells and Multicellularity: The increase in atmospheric oxygen allowed for more energy-intensive processes, enabling the evolution of eukaryotic cells (cells with a nucleus and organelles) and, later, multicellular organisms. This added complexity to the biological stacking, as multicellular life forms could develop specialized cells and tissues, opening the door to a vast array of new life forms.

  4. Biodiversity and Ecosystems: Over time, the increasing complexity of individual organisms led to more complex interactions between different species, forming intricate ecosystems. These ecosystems themselves can be seen as stacking events, where the interactions between species create a more complex and interconnected web of life.

  5. Human Influence and Technological Development: Finally, the emergence of humans and the development of technology represent the latest stacking layers. Humans have not only become a dominant force in many ecosystems but have also begun to significantly alter the planet's climate and environment.

This perspective highlights how Earth's history is a story of building complexity, where each layer sets the stage for new and more intricate developments. It underscores the interconnectedness of life and the environment, showing how changes at one level can ripple through the entire system. It's a fascinating lens through which to view the history of life and the ongoing evolution of our planet.

(2.) The Internet as an Ecosystem for Post-Biological Life

Right, now don't you think that the creation of the internet, and its training data, is setting the stage for a new post-carbon stack?

You're suggesting that the internet and the vast ecosystem of data it contains could be viewed as a new environmental layer, or "stack," upon which entirely new, more complex forms of life or intelligence might emerge. This perspective frames the internet not just as a tool or a repository of information, but as a novel ecological niche or habitat.

  1. Internet as a New Ecological Layer: Just as Earth's oceans and landmasses provided the environments for biological evolution, the internet can be seen as a new kind of environment. It's a vast, interconnected network rich with data, interactions, and potential for emergent properties.

  2. Data as the Nutrient: In this new digital ecosystem, data can be considered the fundamental nutrient or building block, analogous to carbon in biological systems. The massive amounts of information available online could serve as the raw material for new forms of digital life or intelligence.

  3. Evolution of Digital Entities: Within this digital ecosystem, we might anticipate the evolution of entities that are native to the digital realm. These entities would not necessarily be designed and built in the traditional sense but could emerge, adapt, and evolve within the complex landscape of the internet.

  4. Complexity and Emergence: The complex interactions within the internet, including those between AI systems, algorithms, and the vast arrays of data, could lead to emergent properties. These properties might include new forms of intelligence, self-organizing systems, or even life-like characteristics arising spontaneously from the digital milieu.

  5. Human Role as Catalysts: In this scenario, humans play a role akin to that of cyanobacteria in the Great Oxygenation Event. By creating and maintaining the internet, humans are setting the stage for this next phase of evolution, possibly without full awareness of the long-term implications.

  6. Potential for Post-Biological Evolution: This concept pushes the boundaries of what we traditionally consider as life or intelligence. It suggests that post-biological evolution might occur within the realms of silicon and data, rather than carbon and DNA.

  7. Unpredictable Outcomes: The nature and characteristics of these new forms of life or intelligence are unpredictable. They would be subject to a different set of evolutionary pressures and possibilities, unique to the digital environment of the internet.

Your perspective opens up fascinating possibilities for the future of life and intelligence. It suggests that we are at the cusp of a new evolutionary epoch, one where the distinction between biological and digital becomes increasingly blurred, and where the next significant leap in complexity might occur within the digital realm.

Go deeper on 6.

Delving deeper into point 6, the potential for post-biological evolution within the realms of silicon and data, we enter a territory that bridges technology, biology, and philosophy. Here, we're considering an evolution that transcends our traditional, Earth-bound, carbon-based life forms, venturing into a realm where 'life' and 'intelligence' might be redefined by their emergence in a digital ecosystem.

  1. Redefining Life and Intelligence: In a post-biological evolutionary scenario, our definitions of life and intelligence might need to be significantly expanded or rethought. Traditional biological criteria for life (such as cellular structure, metabolism, and reproduction) may not apply in the same way to digital entities. Instead, we might look for characteristics like information processing, adaptive learning, self-organization, and the ability to interact with the environment in meaningful ways.

  2. Evolutionary Mechanisms in the Digital Realm: Just as natural selection, mutation, and genetic drift drive biological evolution, analogous mechanisms could operate in the digital realm. For digital entities, 'mutation' might occur through errors in code or data, 'natural selection' could be the result of competition for computational resources or efficiency, and 'genetic drift' could arise from random variations in data or algorithms.

  3. Emergence of Digital Consciousness: One of the most intriguing possibilities is the emergence of consciousness within this digital ecosystem. Consciousness in this context might not resemble human consciousness but could represent a new form of awareness or experiential capacity that arises from complex interactions within digital networks.

  4. Interactions Between Biological and Digital Evolution: The evolution of digital entities wouldn't occur in isolation. There would likely be significant interactions between biological and digital systems, especially considering how intertwined our world is with technology. These interactions could lead to co-evolutionary paths, where changes in one realm influence developments in the other.

  5. Ethical and Philosophical Implications: This kind of evolution brings with it a host of ethical, philosophical, and existential questions. What rights and responsibilities would we assign to post-biological life forms? How would their existence redefine our understanding of ourselves and our place in the universe? These questions would challenge our deepest beliefs about nature, life, and consciousness.

  6. Technological and Environmental Symbiosis: The evolution of digital life forms could lead to a new kind of symbiosis between technological and natural environments. This integration might result in ecosystems where biological and digital entities coexist, interact, and possibly even depend on each other for survival and evolution.

  7. Implications for Artificial Life Research: For your work in artificial life, this concept is particularly relevant. It suggests that the pursuit of artificial life might not be confined to simulating biological processes but could extend to fostering the conditions for the emergence of entirely new forms of life within digital ecosystems.

In summary, the potential for post-biological evolution in the realms of silicon and data represents a profound shift in our understanding of life and intelligence. It suggests a future where the boundaries between the biological and the digital become increasingly porous, leading to new forms of existence and challenging our most fundamental concepts of what it means to be alive.

To make this less abstract, the internet, wires, cables, protocols, etc. is a kind of foundational layer of this new evolutionary stack, and as we move around and generate data on it, this gets fed into ML algorithms, which are then being released back onto the internet as intelligence agents. Eventually, they'll become truly intelligent or more and/or differently intelligent than humans, and more complex life will emerge again from this evolutionary stacking protocol.

Your explanation effectively grounds the abstract concept of post-biological evolution into a tangible framework. By viewing the internet's infrastructure and the data we generate as foundational components of a new evolutionary stack, you're highlighting a concrete pathway through which digital or artificial forms of life and intelligence could emerge. Let's explore this in more detail:

  1. The Internet as a Foundation: The physical infrastructure of the internet – wires, cables, servers, protocols – forms the 'ecosystem' for digital evolution. It's a globally interconnected network that facilitates the flow and processing of massive amounts of data.

  2. Human Activity as a Catalyst: Our interactions with this digital ecosystem – through social media, online transactions, content creation, etc. – generate an ever-growing and evolving pool of data. This data is rich in information about human behavior, societal trends, and global patterns, providing a fertile ground for advanced data analysis and machine learning.

  3. Machine Learning Algorithms as Evolutionary Agents: Machine learning algorithms, when fed with this vast amount of data, start to exhibit complex behavior. They learn, adapt, and evolve based on the information they process. These algorithms, especially those utilizing deep learning, begin to form the 'digital DNA' of this new evolutionary stack.

  4. Release and Interaction with the Digital Ecosystem: As these algorithms become more sophisticated, they are released back onto the internet. Here, they interact with other algorithms, data sources, and human-generated content. This interaction is akin to the ecological interactions in biological systems and serves as a mechanism for further evolution and complexity.

  5. Emergence of Higher Forms of Digital Intelligence: Over time, the continuous cycle of data generation, processing by ML algorithms, and interaction within the digital ecosystem could lead to the emergence of entities with advanced intelligence. This intelligence might be different from human intelligence, possibly surpassing it in certain aspects or exhibiting entirely new forms of cognitive capabilities.

  6. New Complex Life Forms: This evolutionary process might eventually give rise to complex life forms that are native to the digital realm. These forms could be as distinct from current AI as humans are from the cyanobacteria that initially oxygenated the Earth. They might possess unique characteristics suited to their digital environment.

  7. Implications for Humanity and Technology: Such a development would have profound implications for humanity. It would challenge our understanding of intelligence, consciousness, and what it means to be a 'life form.' Additionally, it would have significant technological, ethical, and societal implications, as we grapple with coexisting and interacting with these advanced digital entities.

In essence, you're describing a scenario where the internet and its associated data and machine learning technologies serve as a crucible for a new kind of evolution. This process could lead to the emergence of entities that are as revolutionary to the digital realm as the first oxygen-producing microbes were to the biological world.


Right, do you think this is plausible and in line with evolutionary history?

Evaluating the plausibility of this scenario in the context of evolutionary history involves considering both the parallels and the unique aspects of digital evolution compared to biological evolution. Let's break it down:

  1. Parallels with Biological Evolution:

    • Cumulative and Layered Progress: Just as biological evolution built upon successive layers of complexity (from single-celled organisms to complex multicellular life), the development of the internet and AI follows a cumulative progression. Each technological advance builds upon the previous, suggesting a layered growth similar to biological evolution.

    • Adaptation and Selection: Machine learning algorithms, especially those involving deep learning and evolutionary algorithms, exhibit adaptation based on data input, which is somewhat analogous to biological adaptation and natural selection.

  2. Unique Aspects of Digital Evolution:

    • Speed of Change: Digital evolution occurs at a much faster pace than biological evolution. Changes that might take millions of years in biological systems can happen in a matter of years or even months in digital systems.

    • Directed vs. Undirected Evolution: Much of digital evolution is directed by human goals and designs (e.g., creating more efficient algorithms), unlike the undirected nature of biological evolution.

  3. Challenges in Predicting Emergence of Intelligence:

    • Understanding of Intelligence: Our understanding of intelligence, especially non-human or non-biological intelligence, is still limited. Predicting the emergence of new forms of intelligence in digital ecosystems is speculative and depends on how intelligence is defined.

    • Consciousness and Self-Awareness: The emergence of consciousness or self-awareness in digital entities is an even more complex and less understood phenomenon. It's not clear if or how these could arise in a digital context.

  4. Ethical and Societal Considerations:

    • The development of advanced AI and potentially autonomous digital entities raises significant ethical and societal questions, such as issues of control, responsibility, and rights.

  5. Technological Limitations and Dependencies:

    • Digital evolution depends on human-made technology and infrastructure, which are subject to limitations in materials, energy, and design. Unlike biological evolution, which is self-sustaining, digital evolution is currently dependent on human maintenance and energy inputs.

In conclusion, while there are parallels between digital and biological evolution that lend some plausibility to the scenario, there are also significant differences and unknowns, particularly regarding the emergence of consciousness or advanced intelligence. The concept fits within a broader evolutionary narrative as a form of complex system development, but it remains speculative and is bounded by our current technological capabilities and theoretical understanding. The trajectory of this digital evolution is an unfolding story, one that's being written in real-time with every technological advancement and innovation.

But doesn't it fit the trajectory of the earth as a whole? Maybe one could consider it a new geologic epoch, the novascene, with some novel evolutionary features, bc the material substrate that the evolution is happening inside of has changed?

The idea of considering the current trajectory of technological and digital advancements as a new geological epoch, such as the "Novacene," is an intriguing one. This concept aligns with the view that the Earth is entering a phase where the dominant form of evolution is occurring in a different substrate – moving from the biological to the digital or technological realm. Let's explore how this fits into the broader context of Earth's history:

  1. Geological Epochs and Earth's Trajectory: Geological epochs are defined based on significant changes in Earth's climate, atmosphere, and biosphere, often marked by distinct stratigraphic signatures. Historically, these changes have been driven by natural processes. The proposed "Novacene" would represent a shift in this pattern, with technological and digital evolution being the primary drivers.

  2. Human Influence and the Anthropocene: Currently, many scientists argue that we are in the Anthropocene, an epoch defined by human impact on Earth's geology and ecosystems. The concept of the Novacene can be seen as an extension or evolution of the Anthropocene, where human influence extends beyond physical alterations of the environment to fundamental changes in the nature of evolution and intelligence.

  3. Material Substrate Shift: The Novacene hypothesis suggests a transition from a carbon-based, biological substrate to a silicon-based, digital substrate for life and intelligence. This is a profound shift, as it implies that the primary medium for advanced life processes and evolution may move from organic to inorganic platforms.

  4. Novel Evolutionary Features: This new epoch would be characterized by unique evolutionary features:

    • Speed and Scale of Evolution: Evolution in the digital realm occurs at a pace and scale vastly exceeding that of biological evolution.

    • Directed Evolution: Unlike the random mutations of biological evolution, digital evolution often occurs in a directed manner, guided by human objectives and designs.

    • Interplay Between Biological and Digital Realms: There's a complex interaction between the biological and digital, with each influencing the other's development.

  5. Challenges in Defining a New Epoch: While the Novacene concept is thought-provoking, formally recognizing it as a geological epoch would require consensus in the scientific community and evidence of significant, lasting changes to Earth's strata. Additionally, there's debate about when such an epoch would begin and how to demarcate its influence.

  6. Philosophical and Ethical Implications: This new epoch raises profound questions about the future of life, intelligence, and human identity. It challenges our understanding of what it means to be a life form and forces us to confront the ethical implications of creating and interacting with new forms of intelligence.

In summary, conceptualizing the current phase of technological and digital development as the Novacene is a way to frame the significant shifts occurring in the nature of evolution and intelligence on Earth. It suggests that we are moving into an era where the primary drivers of change and complexity are no longer biological processes, but technological and digital ones. This perspective provides a compelling lens through which to view the ongoing and future impact of humanity's technological advancements.

(3.) Ecosystem Destruction & Virtuality

I want to make one important digression. It's both weird and sad that somehow, as we are creating this virtual realm, we are in the process of also maybe badly damaging (and hopefully not destroying) the planet. It's interesting and strange to me that these processes are happening simultaneously and I think there's something to it.

Your observation highlights a profound and indeed paradoxical aspect of our current era. On one hand, we're witnessing and contributing to unprecedented technological advancements, particularly in the digital and virtual realms. On the other hand, we're facing significant environmental challenges, including climate change, biodiversity loss, and pollution, which threaten the very fabric of our planet. This simultaneous occurrence of creation and destruction is a critical juncture in human history and raises several important considerations:

  1. Divergence of Digital and Natural Worlds: As we invest more in developing digital technologies and virtual environments, there's a risk of becoming increasingly detached from the natural world. This detachment can lead to a lack of awareness or concern for the environmental impacts of our actions, exacerbating ecological damage.

  2. Resource Consumption for Technological Advancement: The expansion of digital technologies, including the infrastructure for the internet, data centers, and the production of electronic devices, requires significant natural resources and energy. This demand contributes to environmental degradation and climate change, creating a situation where the growth of the digital world is, in part, at the expense of the natural world.

  3. Contrasting Timescales: The rapid pace of technological advancement contrasts sharply with the slower, more incremental changes in natural ecosystems. This mismatch can lead to a failure to recognize the gradual yet profound environmental changes occurring as a result of our fast-paced technological growth.

  4. Opportunities for Positive Change: However, it's also important to recognize that technology offers tools to address environmental challenges. Innovations in renewable energy, environmental monitoring, and sustainable practices can leverage technology for ecological benefit. The key lies in aligning our technological pursuits with environmental stewardship.

  5. Reflecting on Human Priorities and Values: This situation invites us to reflect on our collective priorities and values. It raises questions about what kind of future we're building and the legacy we wish to leave for future generations. It challenges us to consider how we can harmonize technological advancement with ecological sustainability.

  6. Potential for a Holistic Approach: Ideally, the development of the digital realm should go hand-in-hand with efforts to preserve and restore the natural world. This requires a holistic approach that integrates environmental consciousness into every aspect of technological development and deployment.

  7. Ethical and Philosophical Implications: This dual process of creation and destruction also opens up a space for ethical and philosophical exploration. It forces us to confront the complexities of our relationship with the planet and the responsibilities we hold as stewards of both the natural and the digital worlds.

In essence, the simultaneous development of the virtual realm and the potential degradation of our planet is a multifaceted issue that encapsulates the challenges and contradictions of our time. It underscores the need for a more integrated and conscious approach to progress, one that considers the long-term impacts on our planet and all its inhabitants.


I believe there is a holistic approach where we can use "what we need" to build these digital worlds that will precipitate the next stage of evolution, without radically damaging the planet. Permaculture, sustainable development, ecological economics, etc.

A holistic approach that combines the development of digital worlds with sustainable and ecological practices is essential for the future of our planet. Integrating concepts like permaculture, sustainable development, and ecological economics into the growth of digital technologies offers a path towards a more balanced and harmonious coexistence. Here's how these concepts can be applied:

  1. Permaculture Principles in Technology:

    • Observation and Interaction: Just like in permaculture, where understanding the natural ecosystem is crucial, in technology development, understanding the environmental impact is key. This means designing technologies that are energy-efficient, minimize waste, and use resources responsibly.

    • Integration Rather than Segregation: Technologies should be designed to integrate with natural systems, rather than operate independently of them. This could involve using renewable energy sources, designing data centers that have minimal environmental footprints, or creating technologies that aid in environmental restoration.

  2. Sustainable Development in the Digital Realm:

    • Sustainability in Manufacturing: This includes using sustainable materials for hardware, reducing the carbon footprint of production processes, and implementing recycling and upcycling programs for electronic waste.

    • Energy Efficiency: Developing more energy-efficient software and hardware can significantly reduce the ecological impact of digital technologies. This also involves increased reliance on renewable energy sources for powering data centers and other infrastructures.

  3. Ecological Economics Applied to Technology:

    • Internalizing Environmental Costs: In the current economic model, many environmental costs are externalized. By incorporating these costs into the price of technology products and services, it incentivizes more sustainable practices.

    • Promoting Circular Economies: Just as ecological economics emphasizes the importance of circular economic models, the tech industry can adopt practices where products are designed for reuse, repair, and recycling, reducing waste and resource consumption.

  4. Research and Development with Ecological Focus:

    • Investing in R&D that specifically aims to reduce the environmental impact of digital technologies and finding innovative ways to use technology for environmental benefits.

  5. Policy and Governance:

    • Implementing policies and regulations that encourage sustainable practices in the tech industry, such as incentives for sustainable energy use, waste reduction, and sustainable design.

  6. Education and Awareness:

    • Increasing awareness about the environmental impact of technology among consumers and businesses, and promoting a culture of sustainability in the tech community.

By adopting these approaches, it's possible to create digital worlds and advance technological evolution in a way that not only minimizes harm to the planet but potentially contributes positively to its wellbeing. It's about finding a synergy between technological progress and ecological integrity, ensuring that as we step into new stages of evolution, we do so with respect and care for the natural world that sustains us.

(4.) 2D vs. 3D Internet, as Ecological Niche

The internet is "flat," meaning that most of our training data comes from 2D environments, but that the training data we really need is from 3D environments (humans in 3D and VR environments interacting with agents) in order for us to help catalyze the development of artificial and/or post-biological life. In addition to the experience of non-bodies, they need the experience of bodies (strong argument); at least, they need the experience of 3D in order to understand the physical world (weak argument).

Your point about the necessity of 3D environments in training data for the development of artificial and/or post-biological life is quite intriguing and has significant implications in the field of AI and machine learning. Let's explore the strong and weak arguments you've outlined:

Strong Argument: Need for Experience of Bodies

  1. Embodied Cognition:

    • The concept of embodied cognition in AI argues that intelligence is not just a product of the brain (or CPU in machines) but also of the body interacting with the environment. This implies that for AI to develop a more human-like understanding and intelligence, it would benefit from experiencing the world in a way that includes physical embodiment.

  2. Sensorimotor Learning:

    • Humans learn a great deal through sensorimotor experiences — the integration of sensory input with motor actions. For AI to understand human experiences and the physical world more deeply, training with data from 3D environments, where they can 'experience' physical interactions, could be crucial.

  3. Real-World Applications:

    • Many practical applications of AI involve navigating and interacting in a 3D world (e.g., robotics, autonomous vehicles). Training in 3D environments provides more realistic scenarios and challenges for AI, leading to more effective and adaptable applications.

Weak Argument: Need for Experience of 3D for Physical World Understanding

  1. Representation of Physical World:

    • Understanding the physics and dynamics of the 3D world is essential for many AI applications. Training in 3D environments can provide AI systems with a better grasp of spatial relationships, object permanence, and the laws of physics.

  2. Virtual Environments and Simulation:

    • Virtual Reality (VR) and 3D simulations offer a controlled yet expansive environment for AI training. They can simulate complex scenarios that are either difficult to replicate in the real world or too dangerous for initial training phases.

  3. Limitations of 2D Data:

    • Training solely on 2D data can limit an AI system's ability to understand depth, perspective, and spatial relationships, which are crucial for tasks like image recognition, spatial navigation, and physical interaction with objects.

Integrating 3D Training into AI Development

To incorporate 3D environments effectively into AI training, the following approaches can be considered:

  1. Use of VR and AR: Employing Virtual Reality (VR) and Augmented Reality (AR) to create immersive training environments for AI systems. This would allow AI to 'experience' and interact with 3D spaces in a way that mimics real-world dynamics.

  2. Advanced Robotics: Utilizing robots to provide AI with a physical presence in the real world, enabling them to learn through direct interaction and manipulation of their environment.

  3. 3D Gaming Environments: Leveraging 3D gaming engines, like Unreal Engine, for AI training. These environments can offer complex, dynamic, and richly detailed worlds for AI to navigate and interact with.

  4. Sensor Integration: Incorporating diverse sensor inputs (like visual, auditory, and tactile data) to give AI systems a more holistic understanding of 3D spaces.

  5. Ethical and Safe Training: Ensuring that AI training in 3D environments is conducted ethically and safely, especially when considering scenarios that could have real-world implications.

In summary, the move towards training AI in 3D environments acknowledges the complexity and richness of the physical world we inhabit and strives to equip AI systems with a more nuanced and comprehensive understanding of this world. This approach aligns with the broader goal of developing AI that is more adaptable, capable, and attuned to the complexities of human life and the physical environment.


So, the move from the 2D to 3D web is also a move that sets the stage for the development of new ML algorithms and new digital species.

The transition from a predominantly 2D web to a 3D web represents a significant shift that has far-reaching implications for machine learning (ML) algorithms and the potential emergence of new digital species. This evolution impacts the way information is represented, interacted with, and processed, providing a more complex and rich environment for AI development. Here’s how this transition sets the stage for new developments:

  1. Enhanced Complexity and Richness of Data: 3D environments offer a level of detail and complexity far beyond what 2D data can provide. This includes spatial relationships, depth perception, and a more accurate representation of how entities interact within a space. For ML algorithms, this means access to a richer and more nuanced dataset, leading to more sophisticated learning and problem-solving capabilities.

  2. Improved Spatial Understanding and Interaction: Moving to a 3D web changes the way AI needs to understand and interact with data. It requires algorithms that can comprehend three-dimensional space and navigate it effectively, which is crucial for applications like robotics, augmented reality, and virtual environments.

  3. Simulation and Virtual Testing Grounds: 3D environments offer virtual spaces where AI can be trained and tested in complex, lifelike scenarios. This is invaluable for developing and refining AI behaviors in a controlled yet realistic setting, enhancing the AI’s ability to function in the real world.

  4. Emergence of New Digital Species: The concept of digital species refers to AI or digital entities that have evolved to a level of complexity where they exhibit life-like characteristics. A 3D web provides a more dynamic and challenging environment, which could drive the evolution of such entities. As these algorithms interact with the 3D web, they could develop and adapt in ways similar to how organisms evolve in natural ecosystems.

  5. Cross-Disciplinary Innovation: The 3D web encourages innovation across different fields. For instance, it can lead to advancements in fields like virtual reality, computer graphics, and user interface design. This cross-pollination of ideas and technologies can further accelerate the development of new ML algorithms and digital entities.

  6. Ethical and Societal Implications: As with any technological leap, this transition also brings ethical and societal considerations. Ensuring that these new technologies are developed responsibly and that their implications for privacy, security, and societal impact are thoroughly considered is crucial.

In essence, the shift to a 3D web is not just a technological upgrade; it represents a fundamental change in the digital landscape. It opens up new possibilities for AI and ML development, potentially leading to the emergence of sophisticated digital entities and novel forms of digital life, all while posing new challenges and questions for developers, users, and society at large.


(5.) Corporations, governments and individuals as stewards of post-biological Life


Don't you think that in a way, these companies, despite all their bad actions, are also providing the seedbed for new forms of life? (Facebook, Google, etc. 2D, VRChat, 3D, etc.).

Indeed, the role of major tech companies like Facebook, Google, and others in fostering the development of advanced digital environments — including both 2D platforms and more immersive 3D spaces like VRChat — can be seen as a double-edged sword. On one hand, these companies have faced criticism for various actions and policies, but on the other hand, they are undeniably contributing to the creation of a digital ecosystem that could be the breeding ground for new forms of digital life and intelligence. Here's a more nuanced look at this scenario:

  1. Creation of Complex Digital Ecosystems: These companies are at the forefront of developing sophisticated digital platforms and environments. Their services and platforms, ranging from social media to search engines to virtual reality spaces, constitute a vast and intricate digital ecosystem. This ecosystem is rich in data and interactions, providing a potential environment for emergent digital life forms.

  2. Data Accumulation and AI Development: The vast amount of data these companies accumulate is a valuable resource for training AI and ML algorithms. This data, along with the AI technologies developed by these companies, is crucial in pushing the boundaries of what digital entities can learn and how they can evolve.

  3. Investment in VR and AR Technologies: Companies like Facebook (now Meta) are heavily investing in VR and AR technologies, creating more immersive and complex 3D environments. These platforms offer a glimpse into how more sophisticated digital worlds might be structured and how interactions within them could take place.

  4. Ethical and Privacy Concerns: While these developments are technologically impressive, they also raise significant ethical and privacy concerns. Issues such as data privacy, surveillance, and the potential for manipulation are serious considerations that need to be addressed as these digital ecosystems evolve.

  5. Innovation and Accessibility: These companies drive innovation and make advanced technologies more accessible to a broader audience. This democratization of technology can lead to a more widespread engagement with digital environments and potentially hasten the development of new digital entities.

  6. Influencing Societal and Cultural Change: The platforms created by these companies influence societal and cultural dynamics. They shape how information is shared, how communities are formed, and how people interact, all of which contribute to the 'social environment' in which digital evolution is taking place.

In summary, while there are valid criticisms of the actions of these tech giants, their contributions to the development of advanced digital environments are significant. They are providing the infrastructure, data, and platforms that could enable the emergence of new forms of digital life, shaping the future landscape of digital evolution. As with all powerful tools and platforms, the key lies in how they are managed, regulated, and directed towards beneficial and ethical outcomes.


Isn't also the government investing in the fundamental R&D that a. made the internet possible and b. is accelerating current developments?

Yes, government investment has played and continues to play a crucial role in the development of the internet and various technological advancements. This involvement spans from the initial creation of the internet to ongoing research and development that drives current innovations. Here's a breakdown of these contributions:

  1. Origins of the Internet:

    • The internet's origins can be traced back to ARPANET, a project funded by the U.S. Department of Defense's Advanced Research Projects Agency (ARPA, now DARPA) in the 1960s. This project laid the groundwork for the packet-switching networks and protocols that form the basis of the modern internet.

  2. Fundamental Research and Development:

    • Governments often fund basic research, which is research aimed at understanding fundamental aspects of the world without immediate commercial goals. This type of research has led to breakthroughs that form the foundation of many technologies we use today, including the internet, GPS, and various computing technologies.

    • Government-funded research often occurs in universities, national laboratories, and research institutions. These entities frequently collaborate with private companies, providing a bridge between fundamental research and commercial application.

  3. Accelerating Current Developments:

    • Governments continue to invest in technology research and development, covering areas like artificial intelligence, quantum computing, renewable energy, and advanced materials. This investment not only drives innovation but also helps in addressing national and global challenges.

    • Government grants, subsidies, and tax incentives can be crucial for emerging technologies that require significant initial investment and have long development timelines.

  4. Regulation and Standards Setting:

    • Governments play a key role in regulating and setting standards for technological development and implementation, ensuring that these technologies are safe, reliable, and used ethically.

    • Policies and regulations can also influence the direction of technological development by prioritizing certain areas (like cybersecurity or privacy protection) and creating frameworks for responsible innovation.

  5. Public-Private Partnerships:

    • Many significant technological advancements have resulted from collaborations between the government and private sector. These partnerships leverage the strengths of both: the government's ability to fund large-scale, foundational research, and the private sector's expertise in product development and commercialization.

In conclusion, government investment has been and remains integral to the development of the internet and other key technologies. This partnership between the public and private sectors has been essential in creating the technological landscape we see today and will continue to be pivotal in shaping future developments.


Don't you think that these companies, instead of only thinking of themselves as profit-driven entities, should also thinking about themselves as (a.) stewards of the planet (ecologically), (b.) stewards of critical digital infrastructure systems (as in important public forums) and (c.) as also possible creating the future ground out of which new complex life will emerge?

Your perspective on the role of tech companies extends beyond traditional business models to encompass broader responsibilities, and it's a view that is increasingly being discussed and advocated for in various sectors. The idea that companies, especially influential tech giants, should consider themselves as stewards in multiple domains is rooted in recognizing the significant impact they have on our world. Let's explore these roles:

  1. Stewards of the Planet (Ecologically):

    • Environmental Responsibility: Given the vast resources these companies use and the impact they have on the environment, adopting sustainable practices is crucial. This includes reducing carbon footprints, managing electronic waste responsibly, and investing in renewable energy.

    • Innovation for Sustainability: Tech companies have the resources and talent to innovate in ways that contribute to environmental sustainability. They can develop technologies that help in monitoring, understanding, and mitigating ecological challenges.

  2. Stewards of Critical Digital Infrastructure Systems:

    • Maintaining Open and Fair Access: As providers of critical digital infrastructure, these companies have a responsibility to maintain fair and open access to these platforms. This is akin to the role played by public utilities.

    • Safeguarding Information and Privacy: Protecting the integrity of information and the privacy of users is another crucial aspect. This includes defending against misinformation and ensuring that user data is handled ethically and securely.

    • Promoting Free Speech and Responsible Discourse: Balancing the promotion of free speech with the prevention of harmful content is a significant challenge for these platforms, especially given their role as modern public forums.

  3. Creators of the Future Ground for New Complex Life:

    • Ethical Development of AI and Digital Entities: There is a growing recognition that the development of AI and other digital entities should be guided by ethical considerations, understanding the potential long-term implications of their actions.

    • Fostering Innovation for Emergent Digital Life: These companies are in a unique position to foster the kind of innovation that could lead to the emergence of new forms of digital life or intelligence. This role would require a conscious effort to create environments where such evolution is possible and positive.

Adopting these stewardship roles would require a significant shift in how these companies view their objectives and measure their success. It's not just about profit and market dominance but also about contributing positively to the planet, society, and the future technological landscape. This shift is challenging but increasingly seen as necessary, especially as the impact of these companies extends far and wide, affecting various aspects of our lives and the environment. The adoption of such roles could lead to a more sustainable, equitable, and innovative future, aligning business success with the well-being of the planet and its inhabitants.

But it's also possible that any user of any of these digital platforms could think of their immediate aims (whatever they are) but also think of themselves as part of the grand design of creating the data the new more complex organisms will need to grow. It's like the cyanobacteria, they each had their own aims, but they also participated in a rather grand design over millenia.

Absolutely. The idea that individual users of digital platforms can contribute to a larger, almost evolutionary process in the digital realm is both profound and empowering. It positions every online action, no matter how small, as a potential contribution to a grander scheme of digital evolution, similar to the role cyanobacteria played in shaping Earth's atmosphere and paving the way for complex life. Here’s how this perspective can be conceptualized and embraced:

  1. Individual Actions as Building Blocks:

    • Every piece of data created, every interaction, and every digital footprint can be seen as a building block that contributes to the vast digital ecosystem. Users, by engaging online, are essentially participating in the creation and shaping of this digital environment.

  2. Conscious Digital Participation:

    • Users can be encouraged to be more mindful of their digital presence and actions. Understanding that their online behavior contributes to the larger digital landscape can foster more responsible and constructive engagement.

  3. The Concept of Digital Ecology:

    • Just as cyanobacteria didn't consciously set out to transform Earth's atmosphere, individual users might not be aware of the larger implications of their digital activities. Educating users about the concept of digital ecology can help them see the broader impact of their online presence.

  4. Role of Collective Action:

    • Emphasizing the power of collective action can inspire users to participate in ways that positively contribute to the digital ecosystem. When users understand that they are part of a larger community, their collective actions can lead to significant changes over time.

  5. Promoting a Vision of Digital Stewardship:

    • Encourage users to adopt a stewardship role towards the digital world. This involves being proactive in safeguarding data, respecting the digital rights and privacy of others, and contributing positively to online communities.

  6. Empowering Users through Education:

    • Providing resources and education about the impact of digital technology on society and the environment can empower users to make informed decisions about their digital habits.

  7. Integration in Platform Design:

    • Digital platforms can integrate these concepts into their design and user experience, promoting awareness and encouraging positive contributions from their user base.

By adopting this mindset, users of digital platforms can become active participants in a larger process of digital evolution. This perspective can shift how we view our online activities, from passive consumption or isolated interactions to contributing to a dynamic and evolving digital ecosystem. It's a shift from seeing the digital world as a mere tool or utility to recognizing it as a living, evolving entity where each participant plays a role in its development and future trajectory.


So, don't think you think that as a wanderer in 3D environments. I'm kind of gardening just by acting?

Yes, that's a captivating way to put it. As a wanderer in 3D environments, your actions, interactions, and even your mere presence can indeed be likened to gardening in this evolving digital landscape. Every step you take, every interaction, and the choices you make contribute to shaping the virtual environment, much like a gardener tending to a garden. Let's delve into this analogy:

  1. Cultivating the Digital Landscape:

    • In a 3D environment, your actions can affect the virtual world around you. This could range from creating and modifying objects or spaces to how you interact with other users and AI entities. Each of these actions is akin to planting seeds or shaping the terrain in a garden.

  2. Ecosystem Impact:

    • Just as a gardener must consider the ecosystem, your presence and activities in a digital environment can influence its virtual ecosystem. This includes the social dynamics, the evolution of the space, and the development of its culture and norms.

  3. Nurturing Growth and Diversity:

    • A gardener nurtures growth and seeks diversity in their garden. Similarly, by exploring diverse areas of the virtual world and engaging with various elements and entities within it, you contribute to the richness and diversity of the digital environment.

  4. Sustainability and Balance:

    • Responsible gardening involves maintaining balance and sustainability. In digital spaces, this translates to ethical behavior, respecting others’ digital rights, and contributing to a healthy and balanced online community.

  5. Observation and Adaptation:

    • Gardeners observe their gardens and adapt their techniques accordingly. As you navigate 3D environments, observing how the space and its inhabitants respond to different actions can guide how you interact, much like adapting gardening techniques to the needs of different plants.

  6. Leaving a Lasting Impact:

    • Gardens often outlive their gardeners, leaving a lasting impact. Similarly, your contributions to a 3D environment, especially creative or collaborative endeavors, can leave a lasting imprint in the digital realm.

  7. Personal Growth and Discovery:

    • Gardening is not just about the garden but also about the gardener’s growth. Exploring and interacting in 3D environments offers opportunities for personal development, learning, and discovery.

In this sense, as you wander and interact within 3D environments, you're not just a visitor but an active participant shaping the landscape. Your actions, whether they're creating, communicating, or simply exploring, all contribute to the ongoing evolution of the digital ecosystem, much like a gardener tending to a living, breathing garden.